RARE BEAR APRIL-May UPDATE

Lyle Shelton Interview With Mark S. Daniels

Q: Lyle, I'll begin with the engine. What is happening with the engine at this time since we last spoke together?

Lyle: "The power section, which is the crankshaft, crankcase, rods...is being assembled at Aircraft Cylinder & Turbine. Now, there were some delays due to some bad bearings being sent to them, so that has delayed things, and then the re-plating of bearings over in the Bay Area by another company has been kind of slow. I think they should have those bearings by now, and we'll complete that bottom end of the power section before too long, then take the rear supercharger section — the blower section — make a good inspection of that. There may be some damage in the blower section where we'll have to replace some parts. Then we'll attach the blower section to the power section — on the rear of it — and put the nose section, the nose gearing, on the front, then take it over to the hangar in Van Nuys. Then, do what you might call a "top end" — do the cylinders, pistons, ignition, baffling, attach the accessories, put the engine on the engine mount.

And we're still trying to hold to a June the 1st deadline to get the engine ready to trailer it up here to put on the airframe. So, I haven't checked in the last few days, but I'm leaving to go down to Van Nuys-Burbank-San Fernando Valley tomorrow. I'll be down there at least a couple of weeks and I'll be close to that operation and monitoring things. See how we're going on that.

Some of the engine work got slowed up, because some of our sponsor money didn't get in quite on time. We may be kind of slowed down again by some of our sponsor money being a little slower than we anticipated. The engine thing — if we slipped to June 15th — that might be okay, but I want to hold to the June 1st deadline and absolutely have the engine ready to go and run in down there.

It'll be all new components. We're having some trouble getting cylinders and new condition cylinders...some of those got away from us, because the Forest Service bought them from the source we were going to, so we may have to re-barrel some of our older cylinders, get the best cylinder heads off and re-barrel and put them into new condition. Doing that is going to cost us probably a thousand dollars each, so to keep that thing going, we really need to start getting some more of our fan sponsors and jacket sponsors coming in.

They're coming in a little bit slow...some of the people have not issued their payments yet. There are just a few...the rest of them have, so that's the engine thing as well as I can — that generally covers it."

Q: Now, how about the airframe — what's the progress there?

Lyle: "Well, the airframe is coming along okay. We didn't have any major problems. We've got all the instruments, the whole cockpit is torn out, and we’re doing some rewiring and want to rearrange our instrument panel. Looks like we're probably going to have some new radios installed and some new GPS equipment. Hopefully, Garmin is going to help us out quite a bit. We'd sure like to use their equipment and get some help from them. At this point, I'd say it looks pretty good that we're going to get some help from them and from the avionics people out at Stead, who are within Aviation Classics. The Redick boys — the Redick Family — have always helped us. And then, the avionics shop associated with Aviation Classics. Then, Eric Ahlstrom is working within that shop."

Q: Sponsorship...first, let's start with the jacket program...the Fan Sponsorship Program. How is that progressing?

Lyle: "It's coming along. We're still getting a few people. We're at the thirty thousand dollar point, but we need all we can get...we need some more people there. Sharon Coates is running that program. We're getting a thousand, two thousand dollars a week coming in that way right now. Hopefully, when we some of our ads that we've been helped out with — Air Classics Magazine, and Challenge Publications Company down in Van Nuys...George Hulett, specifically and Michael O'Leary — are helping us along with Air & Space, General Aviation News in Tacoma...the Skliars...and also, Pacific Flyer, down in San Diego with Wayman Dunlap...he's helping us out with ad space. It'll probably pick up in the late summer when enthusiasm starts to pick up for the races in September."

Q: There's a lawsuit ongoing — I believe it's down in the Van Nuys (California) area — I was wondering what the latest developments of that were? We understand that a pilot, who formerly flew for the Rare Bear Team, is now suing the Team and the Team Members. This would be unprecedented — this would be a first — because we're talking about a pilot suing volunteers...

(interviewers note: At this point in the interview, Lyle talked at length about his and his team’s bad experiences with Matt Jackson, however, on the advice of his attorney, Lyle asked that none of the information about the ongoing dispute with Mr. Jackson be published.)

Q: Sharon Coates?

Lyle: "Sharon Coates is presently working on the insurance for us, working on setting up the online website sales store...it's probably going as of this week. She's handling some other legal problems for us...just real busy all the time, working on various things, the big thing being the Fan Sponsorship Program, wherein, we're setting that up (the program) to entertain those people during the races, get them the proper jacket with insignias and logos...she's actually handling that — the jacket distribution — and all that business, out of her home up in Idaho."

Q: The parts search — who's handling the search for parts right now?

Lyle: "John Slack, out of Bakersfield, is still looking all over for new cylinders, but we lost two sets of brand new cylinders recently, three or four weeks ago. The Forest Service bought twenty cylinders that we thought we had lined up, and then there was another set of ten new ones and they got away from us, so we may have to remanufacture our cylinders down at Aircraft Cylinder & Turbine. We are sure that we've got some heads that are good as new...we'll have to remanufacture some cylinders, very possibly, up to 'new' condition, but we're not going to be satisfied with anything less than absolutely 'new' condition — pistons and cylinders — we have the pistons."

Q: You have corporate sponsors looking you over at the moment. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Lyle: "Well, we were talking to a software company in Ohio that seemed real interested in us. They did software for automatic flow control plant systems, oil production for oil refining systems and processes, and they would like to get in the airline business with something like an advanced flight data recording system, which would be up to the moment, (information) straight down-information to a recording site on the ground for all airplanes and operations. We're also were talking to the diamond mining people in Northwest Territories — Yellowknife, Canada — there's been a lot of diamond mine development up there in the last ten years, and they were interested in us.

Recently, we've talked to Aviation Partners out of Seattle. Joe Clark is an old acquaintance of mine who heads up that company, and they have developed all those winglets for the airliners that are saving quite a lot in fuel consumption. Reducing drag as much as five to seven percent, which is a big reduction in fuel consumption on a given flight. I've talked to their Chief Engineer and I've sent him a lot of information, and Joe showed some interest when I talked to him down in Southern California about two weeks ago at Clay Lacy's place.

He (Clark) has about 75 Engineers working for him...well, we'd like to get those Engineers helping out on a drag reduction program for the entire airplane, mostly wing work. Working on the airfoil, the wing roots, fairings and strakes...change the airfoil section, leading edge glove maybe...and then do some other basic drag reduction, like do a better job sealing control gaps and stuff like that. Preventing air leakage from around the engine."

Q: In monetary terms, what is your target goal for sponsorship money and how far are you from it at the moment?

Lyle: "We need a minimum of $200,000 to get through this year...to prepare for this year...and that's with all labor contributed on a volunteer basis. So, we're up about the $80,000 to $85,000 mark right now."

Q: So about $115,000 to go?

Lyle: "Yeah, yeah. What we really need — to do this thing right — you just need a flat $350,000 a year. That way, you can hire a mechanic, or two or three, and get things done. Rely less on the volunteers and get things done on a daily basis, rather than nights and weekends."

Q: The hangar facility at Reno-Stead, how is that shaping up?

Lyle: "Well, it's a really nice hangar. We're getting tools and equipment in there. We can do a lot of work in there. It's a nice clean facility. We'll be entertaining our Fan Sponsors in there during the races with a little reception area where we'll have sandwiches and cold drinks all during the day; restroom facilities available for those people, as well as the crew, which is a rare thing out at Stead during the races. Yeah, things are going pretty good. It's a nice, insulated, heated hangar, which doesn't get too hot in the summertime and doesn't have to get too cold in the wintertime. It's going to make things a lot better for us. If we have problems with the airplane, when we're working on it all night, we can push it in there, get out of the sun, the wind and the sand, the cold — whatever — and do our work in there and still entertain our friends, and have a place for the crew to get some chow, for the Fan Sponsors to be close and get refreshments and snacks."

Q: The upgrade of training for John Penney — the Pylon School Training, this year — what's being done in that regards?

Lyle: "The Unlimited check outs and practice are under the auspices of, and are conducted by Unlimited President Art Vance and his elected aviation professional assistants. Art will utilize time at the weekend event to the maximum. John Penney is as qualified and proficient as any racing pilot ever has been, so, he’ll get ‘re-qualified’ and if the Rare Bear happens to be on site at the time, we’ll utilize that time to break-in and shake-down the Rare Bear.

Q: What type of engine does the Rare Bear currently host?

Lyle: "It's a Wright R-3350, the very latest model. Most of the very latest DC-7s and the Lockheed Constellations had an EA / DA series, the very last engines of the 3350s that Wright ever built."

Q: With the Forest Service getting their hands on parts that you guys were looking at and needing for the aircraft, how does it affect spares and being able to support an engine of this nature? How long do you think you'll be able to support this particular engine, and after parts are no longer available, what engine — if any — would you switch the Rare Bear to, to keep it racing?

(interviewer's note: "if any," meaning "retirement" of the racer...though Lyle is such a competitive type, that I wouldn't put it past him to personally pull the aircraft around the course during a race, while John Penney would fly it...<G>).

Lyle: "Well, you know, the Fire Fighting people are going to drop those P-2Vs — they've kept the P-2 Neptunes in service a lot longer than they anticipated (interviewer's note: a possible, rather exciting replacement for the P-2V/SP-2H Neptune currently exists in the A-10 Thunderbolt II, known as the "Firehog:" http://www.firehogs.com ) — and they're driving the cost of these cylinders pretty much out of sight for the racing people and small operator. Eventually, they're going to have to go to P-3s (Orions) or another turbine type (interviewer's note: meaning, P-2 spare parts would then become available to Rare Bear at surplus prices...), but we'll find a way; there's always a way to get it done so that we can continue running the horsepower that we have and can run."

Q: Now, you were looking for sponsors as far as "material" sponsorships — oils, fuels, hydraulic fluids, etc. How is that search progressing?

Lyle: "Not so good. We lost Shell...Shell Development Company expended all their budget for this next year on some T-6 Teams and the US Aerobatic Team, so, we used to get quite a bit of help, but it looks like this year it may be product only. I talked to Paul Royco at some length two or three weeks ago...it's time to call him again to get set up for the oil and lubricants we need, and hydraulic fluid. I think we'll be getting Shell products like that, but we won't get any cash sponsorship out of Shell this year. When you shut down and don't fly for two years, you know, these things drift away.

Q: The rumor mill is reporting that you might switch propellers this year...

Lyle: "We might, if we have enough time to do that. We're thinking we might be better off with a four-blade, high-camber propeller, out here on this tighter course, than we would be with our three-blade propeller, which is better for efficiency in straight-out, higher-indicated airspeeds. So, we'd like to test it. Sometime, we'd like to just run the course, maybe out here at Stead if we can, or run a track. Just get a good test on one propeller, and then change the propeller out overnight, and run it the next day — hopefully under the same conditions — and get a good comparison. We've never been able to get a good comparison of the propellers, performance-wise. I've tried, but I just never could get it under the same conditions that you have out here on the race course."

Q: The aircraft is scheduled to return to Van Nuys — my guess is after Pylon School, as it stands?

Lyle: "Well, after we test it and do a shake down here...unless we make arrangements between now and then to get more work done up here...the plan is, when everything looks good with the airplane and engine up here, we take it down to Van Nuys because we can get more work done on it down there. Most of our basic crew is down there."

Q: When would you expect to return with the aircraft for Reno?

Lyle: "Racetime."

Q: At racetime...qualifications week or a couple of weeks in advance?

Lyle: "We normally get up here on the Sunday before the races and that's when we would bring it back up. I'd rather do testing and operations out of Stead, because it's just a much safer operation with not near the traffic and all the problems you have in operating with the "busiest General Aviation Airport' in the whole United States (interviewer's Note: a distinction that Van Nuys Airport has held for at least two decades, maybe three...and doesn't look to change any time in the near future...). So, actually, I'd rather keep the airplane up here all summer, if we had all our tools, equipment and people up here."

Q: The one question I did forget to ask: the Garmin radio equipment and GPS — what will that do to enhance Rare Bear's operational capability?

Lyle: "It'll just make it nicer to go from A to B, you know, and communications — VHF (interviewer's note: for the novice, "Very High Frequency") communications — are extremely important in the air races out here. Several times in the past years, we've lost communications. Without a good radio, reception has always bad it seems; with all the noise going on and interference from spark plugs...the engine noise and all the 36 spark plugs firing electricity all over the place...you know, reception and transmission is hard to get right in one of these warbirds...these noisy warbirds. So, if we had nice equipment from Garmin for communication — that would be extremely important, oh boy! As for the GPS, that would be just nice as can be to go from A to B."

Q: Are you planning to have telemetry on your aircraft for this year's race?

Lyle: "Yeah, we're planning on it. Our telemetry guy has always been under a real budget squeeze on the Team, but Clark Thompson, from New Mexico, is continuing to improve that telemetry system and we expect to have it up and running. It was mostly running the last time out, but there were a few flights that we did not get full or some information on."

Q: Now, how does telemetry help a pilot in the cockpit when the race is going on? I understand that his ground crew can watch things for him that he can take his mind off of?

Lyle: "Yeah, a little bit, or they can draw his attention to an instrument reading, where he can check it out and compare his reading to what's on the ground. That way he can be more 'heads up,' head out of the cockpit, clearing the area; certainly, that would be the case, if you're in a race, where you really need to be 100 percent visual, never have to look at the cockpit, or at most, look through a heads-up display (HUD), that would give you the essential instrument readings, like oil pressure, RPM, manifold pressure, water injection pressure, Nitrous Oxide, when you're using that. All those pressures, temperatures and measurements — you know, if you could just have a few items on a heads-up display and then have the ground crew call you for anything else that gets slightly out of tolerance or out of limits...that would be the ideal way to do it...because like I said, you need to be 100 percent heads up, visual, out there on the course. That's not possible, but that's what you need."

Q: You mentioned that you'll be using Xtreme Air Racing to "practice fly" while the aircraft is down.

Lyle: "Yeah, I find that there is some valuable training to be had from simulation, including PC simulation. I think it keeps you thinking in real time, and keeps you somewhat coordinated where you're thinking in terms of the same airspeed, sink rates, performance, not forgetting the gear, certain airspeeds for approach, landing or takeoff; I think there's some definite training value in PCs, so I'll be playing around with it. I think there are some other ones. I do have an Aces High and Warbirds, where we even have a computer 'squadron.' I occasionally go out on those missions and just have a little fun, and it keeps you thinking. Changing the view is a skill you don't have in a real airplane, so I'm pretty slow on that, and I'm always getting shot down by fourteen-year-olds (laughs) and guys who really have that view capability in that left hand. But I think it's good. Like, on Aces High, I can pull out a P-51D, and the speeds are about the same and performance is very close. You know, you can go out, fly around the airfield and right on the deck; get yourself scanning for low-level flying; you can pull up and practice emergencies...that would be something that could be very valuable. If you can handle a PC emergency, like engine out, be running on the deck, punch the engine out, instant failure, zoom up to altitude, and practice a few dozens of times or a few hundreds of times getting in your PC P-51, you're going to find it a lot easier to handle a P-51 when you get in the real thing, when the seat-of-your-pants-feel is much different, and the noise and the heat and the vibration and the stick forces are different. Rates of roll, pitch change...you know, are about the same; airspeeds are about the same. It's a training thing and it can be positive if you do it right."

Q: During the late seventies, you ran the California National Air Races at Mojave, and you were the one that gave the Safety Briefing at the '79 race that I recall — I have a picture of you giving the briefing with Bob Hoover there and all the pilots. At the speeds that Air Racers are traveling today, we're getting up there in the 480s, 490s, and pushing the 500 mph envelope in Air Racing. What would you advise Air Racers to do, to stay safe at those speeds?

Lyle: "Well, the airplane's — definitely — it's a different handling situation when you’re really up like, around 400 knots indicated. Controls get real stiff. Running into prop wash can be an extremely scary thing if you're thrown out of control at 400 knots; thrown beyond vertical; and you're holding top stick, top rudder to get out of it, when you're still stuck down in the prop wash, and all of a sudden come wrenching out, possibly overstressing the airplane and pulling G's. It's harder — the cockpits are hotter — Our cockpit just gets real hot. Used to get 160 degrees, we cooled it. Probably, at the very least, 120 - 125 - 130 degrees in the cockpit when you start putting in all that power and that heat from the engine just goes all the way back through the whole airframe into the cockpit.

If you fly a 450 mile an hour course speed at Stead Airport, or any other airport, that used to be extremely fast. In the Bearcat, it's still handling okay, and a 450 mile an hour course speed means you're going about 490 miles an hour true airspeed — 490 - 495 — it handles okay. That's pretty easy. But once you get around 470 - 475, our airplane is real hard to handle, and I know that the P-51s are harder to handle, too. Those ailerons are stiff anyway, on a P-51, so they're really stiff; I know that they've got to go two hands on the stick to control those P-51s. Sometimes, I'm getting where I want two hands on the stick in the Bearcat, even though it's known that it has much lighter control forces."

Q: Now, you mentioned that you had to stand on the rudder pedals at one point, to have control of the aircraft...

Lyle: "Yeah, with that three-blade propeller and the gyroscopic problem it causes from its mass, from its weight...it causes a gyroscopic problem that is real scary. Up in the top range, when you're indicating 380 - 390 knots - 400...which means, when you're getting up in that 475 - 480 mile an hour course speed, and 35 to 40 true airspeed...but if you're running a 480 course, we start to have a gyroscopic problem — it wants to kick the airplane sideways. If you didn't have your feet holding the (rudder)...the airplane would actually go out of control. It would skid sideways and tear apart in the air. So, you have to stand on those rudder pedals like — really — a lot of force. I think maybe a hundred pounds of force or something...it's a physical thing...I'd estimate that I'm pushing on each foot about a hundred pounds worth (of pressure)."

Q: It sounds like — what you would advise pilots is this — to be in top physical shape when they climb into that cockpit...

Lyle: "Well, that helps...you need to be...and I always tried to do roadwork, running, jogging, to keep in shape. I've got a long way to go right now, but before I would want to get back in the air, I would want to get in better physical condition."

Q: I usually leave the last question for my subject...so; do you have anything that you'd like to add to this interview?

Lyle: "We'll be listing the crew on this update. You know, we can't do it without all the volunteer crew people, and I sure hate to see my crew doing all this work for no compensation — monetary compensation — but what really irks me is for my crew to get harassed 'legally' from some source, but it's not only the engine crew, several other people put lots of time and effort throughout the year along with the guys who are doing the wrenching. Take Sharon Coates. She's working quite a few hours every day. She also has put up a $10,000 sponsorship in the name of her husband — I think I've told you this before...

Q: No, no, I wasn't aware of that...

Lyle: "Yeah, in addition, she's already loaned some money to the project, plus a whole lot of her time, plus she's putting up a $10,000 sponsorship in the name of her husband, who died last October, Doug Coates — he was a big fan of Rare Bear — she just sold the ranch and retired now, after Doug died. I get a debrief from her very often. We compare notes on what's been done, what's going on, what's next.

Shirley Kurtz spends a lot of time on the project. Of course, Greg Shaw is coordinating the whole thing down there in Van Nuys; Don Dull is coordinating up here in Reno — he and Craig Boyer — you know, they make their living working on military airplanes, warbirds...so they're pretty highly-skilled guys. It's really good to have them on the Rare Bear project. Not only do they have years of experience on the Rare Bear, but also they've got years of experience on all kinds of Warbirds.

And there are a lot of other people it takes to support Rare Bear, like AAFO, Pylon 1 and Warbird Aero Press...they've just given us great support. The NAG (National Air Racing Group) people have given us free ads and all kinds of publicity. It just takes a ton of people to keep things going."

Q: I thank you very much! We'll end the interview with that...

Lyle: "You're welcome."

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